Smoother swing, longer distance

[titaniummd]

So in an effort for trying to attain greater distance, I tried to swing faster and noticed inconsistent results. I have been working with my Momentus and less of the Medicus to swing faster. The Medicus is about to hit the closet/basement.

However instead of swinger 'harder' when I used a smooth takeaway and a constant tempo, I have been hitting the ball about 10 yards farther. I am trying to let the club do the work, instead of me. Now, I have to use a higher lofted club to achieve the shorter distance. Kind of funny.

[coralpro]

Originally Posted by titaniummd

So in an effort for trying to attain greater distance, I tried to swing faster and noticed inconsistent results. I have been working with my Momentus and less of the Medicus to swing faster. The Medicus is about to hit the closet/basement.

However instead of swinger 'harder' when I used a smooth takeaway and a constant tempo, I have been hitting the ball about 10 yards farther. I am trying to let the club do the work, instead of me. Now, I have to use a higher lofted club to achieve the shorter distance. Kind of funny.

If one has a problem hitting the sweet spot and squaring the face at impact then smoother probably will gain distance. In the end though carry distance can only be lengthened by swing speed but if one can't reliably hit it the same with the swing speed up then they will get better averages by backing down. I found the same thing out the last couple of years but I still want the huge distances so I'm still trying to develop a swing that enables me to use my athletic fast swing but still control it repeatedly. I'm not there yet but I'm getting closer. Instead of in the fairway from 230-250 I'm getting more of the 260-300 that are not far off the fairway around 80 percent of the time. I still get a flaring slice one in a while that may only go 200-210 but with the improved iron control I can still have a good chance of reaching the green on medium par 4's. I still haven't had the chance to attack one of our tougher tight courses to see how much I've improved.

[titaniummd]

I, too, would love the 250-300 yard drive. However, I would like to be hitting from the fairway rather than the rough or from the woods. I just started mimicking the more senior players and liked the smooth swing without trying to kill the ball. I am definitely hitting on the sweet spot for the most part - which is a step forward. The step back will be when I want to try to 'kill it'.

[coralpro]

Well after yesterday I think I have finally found the link I needed to be able to control the bomber swing and it held up for the majority of the drivers I used on the course. Had four in a row that were 289, 295, 301 and 288. Had 2 that were long but were hooks and were way out of the fairway so I didn't laser them. Some of the holes I just hit 3 wood or long irons off the tee for placement. I have no idea what amount of the drive was carry or roll but I hit all but four fairways and only the two hooks and one high fade which was on a par 5 dogleg right which I always lay up on anyways only about 260-265yds leaving 167 to my layup spot in front of a long skinny green with water all the way around three sides. I did have a first for me and that was a 305 yd 3 wood tee shot with a slight breeze helping. I think it probably had about 30 yds roll though as the last 100 yds to the green is downhill.

[mrbillinoc]

Originally Posted by titaniummd

So in an effort for trying to attain greater distance, I tried to swing faster and noticed inconsistent results. I have been working with my Momentus and less of the Medicus to swing faster. The Medicus is about to hit the closet/basement.

However instead of swinger 'harder' when I used a smooth takeaway and a constant tempo, I have been hitting the ball about 10 yards farther. I am trying to let the club do the work, instead of me. Now, I have to use a higher lofted club to achieve the shorter distance. Kind of funny.

You'll hear a LOT of the pro's say they get their MOST distance when they are swinging at 85% to 90%. It really is about "timing" and "position" at impact. My 'ol college golf coach was a FIRM believer in this. He wanted us swinging at 90% ALL the time to develop a smooth rythem. His method of teaching us "tempo"? Any time we spent on the driving range we were REQUIRED to wear leather-soled STREET SHOES. Swing too fast and you'll end up flat on your #@*!!!

That was WAAAAAAAY back in my college days...and I STILL practice this way!!!

Give it a try!

[Badbub45]

It does help swinging smoother. I try to keep a smooth tempo throughtout the swing. Does it happen all the time, no. I always catch myself trying to kill the ball, and I always remember if I slow down the ball will go farther.

[tour_insider]

Distance doesn't come from swinging hard...

[mrbillinoc]

Originally Posted by tour_insider

Distance doesn't come from swinging hard...

I agree 100% !!!

Remember in school during physics class we were always taught that "Mass x Velocity = Distance"?

...well it don't work in golf!!!

[coralpro]

Swinging easy may allow you to tighten your deviation from max to min but to get real distance the only was to get there is to rip it. Stadler says when he says to slow it down, he is telling himself to take it back easy then release hard through the ball. Most of the pros that I've heard discuss it say that if you get it to the top in the right position from there it is just a matter of letting it go. I know many times I take it back quicker and go past parallel or loop the head a little which puts me off plane coming through but then again I'm generally one of those that figures distance offsets drawbacks. I'll say it over and over again that swinging easier can't make the ball go further but it might make the majority go further if one has a hard time hitting the face on the majority of sweetspot or squaring the face at impact. I think in the golfswing the physics would incorpoate distance= mass X velocity X cor. Cor will change from shot to shot depending on ones ability to square and hit the sweetspot. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

[titaniummd]

I believe the consistency that I have, now, is in maintaining the spine angle and hitting the ball the way it is supposed to be hit - as opposed to hitting it fat when I rush the swing or lift my body up when I am not finished with the shot.

[coralpro]

Originally Posted by titaniummd

I believe the consistency that I have, now, is in maintaining the spine angle and hitting the ball the way it is supposed to be hit - as opposed to hitting it fat when I rush the swing or lift my body up when I am not finished with the shot.

That's really what it is all about. I found I could have consistency by swinging easy and I could hit a ton of fairways but I prefer the bomber swing while I'm still able to swing it fast and have just been trying to get that consitent move so that I square the face most of the time. For me, it is all about getting my hips turned quick enough to get them out of the way. I've been trying different trigger thoughts to get it and sometimes I think I'm there and other times I prove to myself it isn't quite dependable yet.

[tour_insider]

Originally Posted by coralpro

Swinging easy may allow you to tighten your deviation from max to min but to get real distance the only was to get there is to rip it. Stadler says when he says to slow it down, he is telling himself to take it back easy then release hard through the ball. I'll say it over and over again that swinging easier can't make the ball go further but it might make the majority go further if one has a hard time hitting the face on the majority of sweetspot or squaring the face at impact. I think in the golfswing the physics would incorpoate distance= mass X velocity X cor. Cor will change from shot to shot depending on ones ability to square and hit the sweetspot. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

My only comment would be there is a difference between swinging hard and releasing hard through the ball. The speed at impact comes from whipping the clubhead through impact, which in turn comes from holding the angle of your wrists to your forearms as long as you can.

Most people who "swing hard" do so right from the initial move from the top, and they blow any speed they have well before they get to the ball. If you swing "slower" and smoother, you're more likely to hold that angle longer, and the longer you do, the farther you'll hit the ball.

Clubhead speed doesn't come from swinging hard.

[Bigvivec]

I had an instructor who worked hard with me to develop this speed through the impact area...the practice was putting my feet together and swinging toe up to toe up with a mid iron, but concentrating on maintaining width in the swing and really stretching the heel of left hand on the backswing away from the body, and likewise with the heel of the right hand on the toe up position in the follow through...the ball went straight as well...it was like someone turned on a light and I realized that you don't swing "hard" to make the clubhead move fast, rather you cross the wrists over hard through impact, maintain width and tempo...I knew that I was doing it right when my forearms and wrists started screaming...have to remind myself time to time...best part is that you can actually make proper contact because you aren't trying to hammer the ball with all your might...

[coralpro]

Originally Posted by tour_insider

My only comment would be there is a difference between swinging hard and releasing hard through the ball. The speed at impact comes from whipping the clubhead through impact, which in turn comes from holding the angle of your wrists to your forearms as long as you can.

Most people who "swing hard" do so right from the initial move from the top, and they blow any speed they have well before they get to the ball. If you swing "slower" and smoother, you're more likely to hold that angle longer, and the longer you do, the farther you'll hit the ball.

Clubhead speed doesn't come from swinging hard.

I think we both understand the double pendulum effect. To say swinging easier makes you hit it further is not correct in itself, though. Swinging correctly and releasing the club correctly makes for the maximum potential depending on how fast the face speed measures when it contacts the ball. I can swing fast enough without the release to sometimes carry the ball 270-280 and if I get the release timed it can carry over 300+. It does get to be more difficult to time everything the quicker the SS becomes and that is why many say you can hit it further by slowing down. I know I can hit the fairway most of the time if I want a 220-240 carry or maybe get a touch more but unless playing a short course that leaves a very long iron or wood into a par 4 so I have been working on developing a swing mechanics that allows me to use my potential with consistency. It's a work in progress but Rome wasn't built overnight.

[Bigvivec]

Originally Posted by coralpro

I think we both understand the double pendulum effect. To say swinging easier makes you hit it further is not correct in itself, though. Swinging correctly and releasing the club correctly makes for the maximum potential depending on how fast the face speed measures when it contacts the ball. I can swing fast enough without the release to sometimes carry the ball 270-280 and if I get the release timed it can carry over 300+. It does get to be more difficult to time everything the quicker the SS becomes and that is why many say you can hit it further by slowing down. I know I can hit the fairway most of the time if I want a 220-240 carry or maybe get a touch more but unless playing a short course that leaves a very long iron or wood into a par 4 so I have been working on developing a swing mechanics that allows me to use my potential with consistency. It's a work in progress but Rome wasn't built overnight.

On the one hand I see what you are saying in terms of distance, but on the other, what courses are you playing that leave you out of mid iron range with a 240 shot down the middle? If you can carry a drive 280, you should have no problem easing back and hitting a 7 iron 175...that's 415 yds right there...the good players that I know are not terribly long, but they are terribly straight... whatever is most important to you I suppose...

I think the point that is being missed is that the swing is not slowing down...it just feels like it because the focus is on good mechanics and the action Tour Insider so aptly described, not on threshing the ball...

You don't hit the ball with your backswing or the start of your downswing...

[coralpro]

Originally Posted by Bigvivec

On the one hand I see what you are saying in terms of distance, but on the other, what courses are you playing that leave you out of mid iron range with a 240 shot down the middle? If you can carry a drive 280, you should have no problem easing back and hitting a 7 iron 175...that's 415 yds right there...the good players that I know are not terribly long, but they are terribly straight... whatever is most important to you I suppose...

I think the point that is being missed is that the swing is not slowing down...it just feels like it because the focus is on good mechanics and the action Tour Insider so aptly described, not on threshing the ball...

You don't hit the ball with your backswing or the start of your downswing...

I fully understand what he was saying and I agree with it but wanted to clearify it so that those that just merely think swinging easy makes it go further would not wonder why it didn't. Tension is generally the killer to swing speed and most people that try to rip it grip the club too tightly preventing the second pendulum effect from happening.

Some courses I play have 440 yd par fours or longer. Yes if I could hit it 280 all the time I should have no problem but again I don't and I stated that. I also stated it depended on the course. If I play a 440-470 par 4 then how is a 240 yd drive down the middle going to reach the green with a mid iron? I had a second shot last week into a par 5, 515 yds that was a 6 iron to pin high with the wind helping and it landed just right on the edge of the slope to the green. My norm for a 6 iron is 160 with my normal swing. I don't hit irons with the SS I use with driver. I have hit an 8 iron 185 before but that is not a norm and I sure don't tell people that is my 8 iron distance. Do I think I'm as good as Tiger? No....Am I going to stop trying to be as good? No....I am a realist, but not a defeatist.

[Bigvivec]

Originally Posted by coralpro

I fully understand what he was saying and I agree with it but wanted to clearify it so that those that just merely think swinging easy makes it go further would not wonder why it didn't. Tension is generally the killer to swing speed and most people that try to rip it grip the club too tightly preventing the second pendulum effect from happening.

Some courses I play have 440 yd par fours or longer. Yes if I could hit it 280 all the time I should have no problem but again I don't and I stated that. I also stated it depended on the course. If I play a 440-470 par 4 then how is a 240 yd drive down the middle going to reach the green with a mid iron? I had a second shot last week into a par 5, 515 yds that was a 6 iron to pin high with the wind helping and it landed just right on the edge of the slope to the green. My norm for a 6 iron is 160 with my normal swing. I don't hit irons with the SS I use with driver. I have hit an 8 iron 185 before but that is not a norm and I sure don't tell people that is my 8 iron distance. Do I think I'm as good as Tiger? No....Am I going to stop trying to be as good? No....I am a realist, but not a defeatist.

If you are playing 470 par 4s, you had better be getting 280 off the tee and be able to hit long irons/hybrids/fw woods as well, otherwise I would say that you are overreaching your ability...

I like the story of Davis Love III not being allowed by his father to play anything but the ladies tees until he could play them even par...accuracy is what golf for me is about and the guy at the end of the range with the ego driver gives me a headache...

[coralpro]

Originally Posted by Bigvivec

If you are playing 470 par 4s, you had better be getting 280 off the tee and be able to hit long irons/hybrids/fw woods as well, otherwise I would say that you are overreaching your ability...

I like the story of Davis Love III not being allowed by his father to play anything but the ladies tees until he could play them even par...accuracy is what golf for me is about and the guy at the end of the range with the ego driver gives me a headache...

Maybe you haven't played any of those courses that take just a few holes that they can add yardage to without buying more property but I've been on a few where most are decent par 4's with the majority in the 370-410 range but they have a couple that are just perfect for adding yardage to to make them more competitive with other courses that post larger yardages. I'm not so ego filled that I will play from the back tees if I think the majority of par 4's are not reachable with mid irons.

[Bigvivec]

Originally Posted by coralpro

Maybe you haven't played any of those courses that take just a few holes that they can add yardage to without buying more property but I've been on a few where most are decent par 4's with the majority in the 370-410 range but they have a couple that are just perfect for adding yardage to to make them more competitive with other courses that post larger yardages. I'm not so ego filled that I will play from the back tees if I think the majority of par 4's are not reachable with mid irons.

What does that mean...that the tee boxes are behind the posted yardages for each tee? Sure...seems like just about every course has the championship tee box, or the last tee that stretches back behind the yardage stone/marker on the "tip" tee box...my question is what are you as an 80-100 shooter doing ba