Pitch and Run...

[Bigvivec]

July 30th Wednesday

So I was practicing today and am starting to change my philosophy of how to get the ball to the hole from 40 yds in…I was on the pitching green and was hitting from different locations…in one area the ground between the ball and the hole was fairly firm with a small run up to the green…another area featured uneven ground, more dramatic elevation change to the elevated green surface…I lofted pitches from the second location and ran them in low from the first…on the whole, the balls run in low ended closer to the hole than the pitched balls even though I haven’t been practicing the low approaches…tells me that the low approach is a much more consistent technique and one that should be used when possible…I also figured out how to more consistently hit a knuckleball waist high pitch that will end up with ¾ carry and ¼ roll out which I need for when I miss greens and have to pitch out of trees with low hanging branches over a hazard to the green (a spot that I shouldn’t be in to start with, but happens more frequently than I’d like)…I used to be a fly it to the hole guy, but am slowly changing that and results are closer more often…

July 31st

I played today and used this shot in lieu of flying it to the hole on three occassions...parred all three holes I'm going to drop some balls and hit some on course practice shots next time out...

[mr3856a]

I think humans instinctually are better at judging distances rolling things along the ground rather than a high toss, for example. The only thing that concerns me is uneven ground (or grass for that matter), where a ball might hit into a slight upslope or mound and kill its momentum.

Keep us abreast of your results, I'm curious to see how this works out.

[Bigvivec]

Originally Posted by mr3856a

I think humans instinctually are better at judging distances rolling things along the ground rather than a high toss, for example. The only thing that concerns me is uneven ground (or grass for that matter), where a ball might hit into a slight upslope or mound and kill its momentum.

Keep us abreast of your results, I'm curious to see how this works out.

When I practiced yesterday this happened...funny kicks, slower grass, strange popups....and they all ended around the target anyway for the most part, and were closer to the whole by a good margin when compared to the results with the lofted wedge...

[Bigvivec]

I couldn't help myself though...on the last hole I played today I was lined up perfectly for a little pitch and run, but went with the showy and more fun option of the waist high knuckleball two hop stop pitch...tried two from that spot and hit both exactly the same...perfectly executed to 10 ft past the hole...

[Wazmankg]

Originally Posted by mr3856a

I think humans instinctually are better at judging distances rolling things along the ground rather than a high toss, for example. The only thing that concerns me is uneven ground (or grass for that matter), where a ball might hit into a slight upslope or mound and kill its momentum.

I think the terrain in between matters. There are situations where a pitch & run just isn't feasible. But it's the better option in most cases, especially for mid-high handicappers. I try for no more than 1 bounce before the green/slash fringe on the longer ones(40 yards) which usually kills it enough for it to hop on and into a nice roll. I also use only my PW for these shots. I used to fool around with everything up to a 6-iron. But with me not really doing much practicing, I've found much more predictable results by getting comfortable with one club and de-lofting or lofting the blade as needed.

[Darth Fader]

A well executed lob shot looks better,but i will play a pitch and run whenever possible. Having grown up playing links golf i had to learn this shot pretty quickly,its by far the most effective.

[deronsizemore]

I always opt for the pitch and run when I can. I used to be a lobber on every shot around the green and I finally wised up and realized it was very unlikely for me to get it close consistently. I'm much better around the greens with the pitch and run.

[JPsuff]

.


All things being equal, I'll go with a pitch & run most times.
It's a lot harder to judge flight than it is to judge roll.


-JP

[alangbaker]

Originally Posted by JPsuff

.


All things being equal, I'll go with a pitch & run most times.
It's a lot harder to judge flight than it is to judge roll.

I've never understood this. In order to judge the roll, you need to judge the flight anyway, so how does that make sense?

[Wazmankg]

Originally Posted by alangbaker

I've never understood this. In order to judge the roll, you need to judge the flight anyway, so how does that make sense?

I don't know exactly how to explain it but it does. Drop 10 balls on the fringe about 60' from the cup the next time out. High pitch 5 with your SW and for the other 5 use your putter. Let us know what the results were. For a 40 yard shot you're only going to have to carry it 10 yards or so. It's nearly all carry with a high pitch. Maybe you're different but I think most can fly it 10 yards much more consistently than they can 40. The roll becomes predictable with repetition.

[PA PLAYA]

The high-lofted pitch requires the golfer to hit an intermediate target much further away from him. The traditional bump-n-run offers a much closer intermediate target. I'm gonna wager a guess that hitting a spot on the green (used for an intermediate target) from 5 yards off the green is probably much easier than hitting the intermediate target 10-15 yards further away. So that part of the equation is simpler, then it becomes all about pace.

For a good number of years I would use my SW or LW exclusively for most all of my greenside shots. The past couple of years, I've started using GW, PW, and even 9iron on some occasions, and have found it much easier to control distance using the lower-lofted option. I'm much more likely to hole out a pitch or a chip with the bump-n-run than the high loft variety. It took a number of years for me to figure it out, but I've finally come around on the idea.

[Bulls9999]

Exactly for me too. I will often use a 52-degree Vokey to skip-once and stop with breaks on flat ground or downhill, but with severe uphill, I'd rather use a pitch and run with an 8- or 9-iron that will release further uphill.

Originally Posted by mr3856a

I think humans instinctually are better at judging distances rolling things along the ground rather than a high toss, for example. The only thing that concerns me is uneven ground (or grass for that matter), where a ball might hit into a slight upslope or mound and kill its momentum.

Keep us abreast of your results, I'm curious to see how this works out.

[Bigvivec]

Originally Posted by mr3856a

I think humans instinctually are better at judging distances rolling things along the ground rather than a high toss, for example. The only thing that concerns me is uneven ground (or grass for that matter), where a ball might hit into a slight upslope or mound and kill its momentum.

Keep us abreast of your results, I'm curious to see how this works out.

Well, this rocks over what I had been doing...I left three inside of 2 feet today with two on the lip, one off the flagstick, holed out two days ago, and have been getting closer on average with shots a little farther off the green, including back to back 5 irons on consecutive days from 155 and 170 for birdie...just plain easier and even on the ones that don't get super close, I haven't had any this week that I chunked or thinned...I think I am done with the showy spinny shots...I can't see the appeal anymore...I hit a full pitch today that I backed up, but that was a little different as it was a full swing shot and just short of one of my measured backswing distances...

[Bulls9999]

Big, you do know what is part of your good fortune, don't you? The general scenario of "you do well what you do often", especially when it comes to golf.

If you do pitch-and-runs more often, then you're practice time with it is more and you're likely getting better at that which you practice more.

Or Gary Player's addage, "The more I practice, the luckier I get".

Originally Posted by Bigvivec

Well, this rocks over what I had been doing...I left three inside of 2 feet today with two on the lip, one off the flagstick, holed out two days ago, and have been getting closer on average with shots a little farther off the green, including back to back 5 irons on consecutive days from 155 and 170 for birdie...just plain easier and even on the ones that don't get super close, I haven't had any this week that I chunked or thinned...I think I am done with the showy spinny shots...I can't see the appeal anymore...I hit a full pitch today that I backed up, but that was a little different as it was a full swing shot and just short of one of my measured backswing distances...

[Bigvivec]

Originally Posted by Bulls9999

Big, you do know what is part of your good fortune, don't you? The general scenario of "you do well what you do often", especially when it comes to golf.

If you do pitch-and-runs more often, then you're practice time with it is more and you're likely getting better at that which you practice more.

Or Gary Player's addage, "The more I practice, the luckier I get".

Well...

I play golf every day and have scored more or less the same (save for some slumps and hot streaks) for over a year now...something's gotta give

[Bulls9999]

Big,

I meant using pitch-and-runs vs. wedge to get the ball close to the hole. I thought you said you just switched to the pitch-and-run recently (is that the same as the 'bump-and-run', or 'chip-and-run', which I use interchangeably?).

Originally Posted by Bigvivec

Well...

I play golf every day and have scored more or less the same (save for some slumps and hot streaks) for over a year now...something's gotta give

[Bigvivec]

Originally Posted by Bulls9999

Big,

I meant using pitch-and-runs vs. wedge to get the ball close to the hole. I thought you said you just switched to the pitch-and-run recently (is that the same as the 'bump-and-run', or 'chip-and-run', which I use interchangeably?).

I know what you meant...just joking around bud...and yes, I've been practicing it (about 6-7 hours so far on the practice green/ pitching area) and playing it on the course every chance that I get, so while it is gratifiying to be improving, I really believe that a good part of my success has to do with the inherent forgiveness of the technique...it's easier to do plain and simple...

[Bulls9999]

Well, as far as inherent forgiveness and plain and simple, isn't that a method you find "old fellas" using more (than trying to flop it close)?....don't they use methods that by experience and deblitating abilities, use methods that get the job done easy?....and weren't the "old fellas" the first guys to use the hybrids which have now migrated heavily into the PGA ranks (maybe only Tiger doesn't have one yet).

I remember trying to convince my young son about the merits of a 'bump-and-run' shot to have in his bag as opposed to rely on the Mickelson Flop shot, lol. It is a great shot to have in the bag.

Not saying you're old, but just saying if 'older guys' use something, it's because it works easily for them....if something works more easily for older guys, it should work more easily for younger guys too?

Originally Posted by Bigvivec

I know what you meant...just joking around bud...and yes, I've been practicing it (about 6-7 hours so far on the practice green/ pitching area) and playing it on the course every chance that I get, so while it is gratifiying to be improving, I really believe that a good part of my success has to do with the inherent forgiveness of the technique...it's easier to do plain and simple...

[Bigvivec]

Originally Posted by Bulls9999

Well, as far as inherent forgiveness and plain and simple, isn't that a method you find "old fellas" using more (than trying to flop it close)?....don't they use methods that by experience and deblitating abilities, use methods that get the job done easy?....and weren't the "old fellas" the first guys to use the hybrids which have now migrated heavily into the PGA ranks (maybe only Tiger doesn't have one yet).

I remember trying to convince my young son about the merits of a 'bump-and-run' shot to have in his bag as opposed to rely on the Mickelson Flop shot, lol. It is a great shot to have in the bag.

Not saying you're old, but just saying if 'older guys' use something, it's because it works easily for them....if something works more easily for older guys, it should work more easily for younger guys too?

Yes and no...if you have the clubhead speed to hit long irons, they are still more accurate than hybrids IMO...a whole lot less forgiving, but if you are good with them the long iron is a better tool...I now keep two hybrids up from zero to one that I had in the bag at the start of the year...they are consistenly better for me and that is what it is all about...

Huge long drives, wedges that spin and dance, moonshot lobs, approaches that stop on a dime like a thrown dart...all of these are fine ways to play the ball, and when pulled off well are worthy of a little chest thumping because they are spectacular looking shots...however, I am finding in the current conditions on my course that dribbling like runners that sneak onto the green and crawl up next to the hole, while being less spectacular, seem to cozy up more often than their spectcular cousins...I'm leaving the glam behind