X-Outs - Legal or Illegal?

[Pistol]

I bought some X-Out Pro-V1's from Dicks Sporting goods during Christmas for $23 a dozen. Legal or Illegal, what do you think?

[JimSomebody]

I think there are various reasons (not related to the rules of golf) why a manufacturer would X-out some balls. Nothing illegal about them, so far as I know.

[atticusfinch]

Originally Posted by Pistol

I bought some X-Out Pro-V1's from Dicks Sporting goods during Christmas for $23 a dozen. Legal or Illegal, what do you think?

The USGA says:

Q. May I use an "x-out" ball or a ball stamped with "Practice" to play a round of golf?

A. Our present policy provides that if the List of Conforming Golf Balls or the One Ball Condition is in effect, a practice or logo ball may be used provided the other markings on the ball (i.e., pole and seam) correspond exactly to a ball listing on the current List of Conforming Golf Balls. Balls labeled with “PRACTICE” or a circled “P”, are essentially treated as a logo ball (such as a Mickey Mouse emblem). A player's name stamped on the ball is also acceptable. However, the original ball markings (i.e., pole and seam markings) must be readable in order for a Rules Official to determine whether that ball is on the List of Conforming Golf Balls. X-Out balls are not permitted to be used in any competition in which the List of Conforming Golf Balls or the One Ball Condition is in effect. However, if neither of these Conditions are in effect, X-Out balls may be used because all balls are presumed to conform unless they have been tested and found not to conform or are obviously non-conforming (e.g., too small or too heavy). (See Decisions 5-1/4 and US/5-1/101).

[Dormie]

Originally Posted by Pistol

I bought some X-Out Pro-V1's from Dicks Sporting goods during Christmas for $23 a dozen. Legal or Illegal, what do you think?

How did they feel? Like normal Pro-V1's? Because that's all that matters. And judging from your abilities, you'd probably be one of the ones who could tell the difference.

[Pistol]

Originally Posted by Dormie

How did they feel? Like normal Pro-V1's? Because that's all that matters. And judging from your abilities, you'd probably be one of the ones who could tell the difference.

I haven't had a problem with any that I've played with. If I look close enough I can see some type of cosmetic blemish on each ball. Most have some smudges on the lettering but are not noticable unless you really look. I really don't think Titliest would put "defective" balls out on the market just to get a few bucks out of them. I think it would cost them more money in the long run by having a nonperforming ball being played. I asked the question because when I play the ball and someone notices they are X-outs they automatically think they are illegal.

[90civicracer]

I picked up a few dozen TM TP x-outs and as with you, most everything was cosmetic. On some of them, they were just a slight off white, while on others the stamping wasn't on straight.

[HackBlack]

Originally Posted by atticusfinch

The USGA says:

Q. May I use an "x-out" ball or a ball stamped with "Practice" to play a round of golf?

A. Our present policy provides that if the List of Conforming Golf Balls or the One Ball Condition is in effect, a practice or logo ball may be used provided the other markings on the ball (i.e., pole and seam) correspond exactly to a ball listing on the current List of Conforming Golf Balls. Balls labeled with “PRACTICE” or a circled “P”, are essentially treated as a logo ball (such as a Mickey Mouse emblem). A player's name stamped on the ball is also acceptable. However, the original ball markings (i.e., pole and seam markings) must be readable in order for a Rules Official to determine whether that ball is on the List of Conforming Golf Balls. X-Out balls are not permitted to be used in any competition in which the List of Conforming Golf Balls or the One Ball Condition is in effect. However, if neither of these Conditions are in effect, X-Out balls may be used because all balls are presumed to conform unless they have been tested and found not to conform or are obviously non-conforming (e.g., too small or too heavy). (See Decisions 5-1/4 and US/5-1/101).

Good info. I was looking for this info last year and couldn't find the rule/decision related to it.

In our cities Mid-Am last year, I was going to play some Nike One-Black's that had 'Practice' stamped on them. I asked several competivie golfers if they knew for sure what the ruling was, and no one could give me a clear answer. The morning of the tournament, I asked the hosting pro and he said not to play them. But, he didn't reference the One Ball rule, which we were playing for that event. Fortunately, I prepared for that ruling by brining a couple sleeves of non-practice balls.

[Diane]

I understand that X Out balls have cosmetic blemishes for the most part, but you really don't know why they are X Outs when you purchase them. So - here is my question - why would you play an X Out in a tournament even if it's legal? Why give yourself a potential handicap by playing a ball that may have more than a cosmetic blemish? I don't understand the rationale.

[HackBlack]

Originally Posted by Diane

I understand that X Out balls have cosmetic blemishes for the most part, but you really don't know why they are X Outs when you purchase them. So - here is my question - why would you play an X Out in a tournament even if it's legal? Why give yourself a potential handicap by playing a ball that may have more than a cosmetic blemish? I don't understand the rationale.

During the manufacturing process, balls are monitored for defects. Those not passing at certain stages would get kicked out before it even made it to the final stage of painting. So, any ball with a physical malfunction wouldn't make it. The vast majority of balls that are x-outs are that way because of something happening while the paint & lettering is applied.

[Dormie]

Originally Posted by HackBlack

During the manufacturing process, balls are monitored for defects. Those not passing at certain stages would get kicked out before it even made it to the final stage of painting. So, any ball with a physical malfunction wouldn't make it. The vast majority of balls that are x-outs are that way because of something happening while the paint & lettering is applied.

Then why would ANYONE buy the Pro-Vs at full price? These Pro-V1 X-outs are available at Dick's all the time. I'm going to load up today!

[Diane]

Originally Posted by Dormie

Then why would ANYONE buy the Pro-Vs at full price? These Pro-V1 X-outs are available at Dick's all the time. I'm going to load up today!

Dormie - even HackBlack says "vast majority". Just remember - you get what you pay for.

[Pistol]

Originally Posted by Diane

Dormie - even HackBlack says "vast majority". Just remember - you get what you pay for.

I play the X-Outs for regular afternoon rounds and other non tournament rounds. For tournaments I play regular Pro V1s. Even with the lower price I'm so frugle I find it hard to pull out a brand new ball when I have a ball that a a little life left in it.

[OnePutt]

I can't tell you what the USGA rules have to say about X-outs, but I did read just last month the X-outs are not legal to use in a tournament, but Practice balls are. I have no idea what exactly the difference is between a Practice ball and an X-out, but for some reason the X-outs are not legal and the Practice balls are.

[atticusfinch]

Originally Posted by OnePutt

I can't tell you what the USGA rules have to say about X-outs, but I did read just last month the X-outs are not legal to use in a tournament, but Practice balls are. I have no idea what exactly the difference is between a Practice ball and an X-out, but for some reason the X-outs are not legal and the Practice balls are.

Read all the posts in this string...it will become clear.

[Batteaux]

This Site may answer a few questions:

Golf FAQ - What are X-Out Golf Balls and are They Legal?

[Pistol]

Originally Posted by Batteaux

This Site may answer a few questions:

Golf FAQ - What are X-Out Golf Balls and are They Legal?

The site answers the question about how the X-Out ball comes to be, but I don't think they are correct about the ball being illegal for tournament play. According to the USGA as long as the ball is on the conforming list it is legal.

[Fileygolfer]

Originally Posted by Pistol

The site answers the question about how the X-Out ball comes to be, but I don't think they are correct about the ball being illegal for tournament play. According to the USGA as long as the ball is on the conforming list it is legal.

Totally agree with you.
Putting three X's across a name doesn't change the ball.
BUT!
As an X-out, that ball may be under/over sized, under/over weighted so NOT LEGAL from that point so it would be UNADVISABLE to play an X-out in a Tournament.
Here in the UK, we can buy Lake Balls cheap, mostly shipped in from the States so they are the most popular option of buying quality cheap.

[OnePutt]

atticush This is directly from your post.
"X-Out balls are not permitted to be used in any competition in which the List of Conforming Golf Balls or the One Ball Condition is in effect"

Unless you can translate this to mean something different, it means X-out balls are not permitted in competition. And not permitted is exactly what I posted for X-out's So what's your problem ?

[atticusfinch]

Originally Posted by OnePutt

atticush This is directly from your post.
"X-Out balls are not permitted to be used in any competition in which the List of Conforming Golf Balls or the One Ball Condition is in effect"

Unless you can translate this to mean something different, it means X-out balls are not permitted in competition. And not permitted is exactly what I posted for X-out's So what's your problem ?

I got no problem. My post is a direct cut and paste from the usga. And it does not mean what you say.

It says x-outs cannot be used where the one ball rule or conforming list is in effect. These rules are not in effect for all competitions, so your point is too broad.

[Diane]

Ok - you guys can argue one ball (whatever that is) and conforming list all you want. I think using an X-Out ball during any kind of competition is foolish and I can't imagine why anyone would think otherwise. IMO - it's not even worth discussing. So you save a few bucks, but at what cost.

[atticusfinch]

Originally Posted by Diane

Ok - you guys can argue one ball (whatever that is) and conforming list all you want. I think using an X-Out ball during any kind of competition is foolish and I can't imagine why anyone would think otherwise. IMO - it's not even worth discussing. So you save a few bucks, but at what cost.

The one ball rule:

c. One Ball Condition

If it is desired to prohibit changing brands and models of golf balls during a stipulated round, the following condition is recommended:

"Limitation on Balls Used During Round (Note to Rule 5-1):

(i) One Ball Condition
During a stipulated round, the balls a player plays must be of the same brand and model as detailed by a single entry on the current List of Conforming Golf Balls.

Note: If a ball of a different brand and/or model is dropped or placed, it may be lifted, without penalty, and the player must then proceed by dropping or placing a proper ball (Rule 20-6).

[Diane]