Romero penalized 1 stroke for ball against rake

[Bulls9999]

Just turned the GC on and they showed yesterday Romero's ball going through the green and stopped against/by the rake on the hillside above the bunker. They said he marked the ball with a tee, removed the rake (before the official got there)....and then the official gave him a 1-stroke penalty for 'moving the ball'.

They didn't say more on this but I wondered, what else could you have done, except yes, wait for an official? Isn't that the proper method?

[atticusfinch]

Originally Posted by Bulls9999

Just turned the GC on and they showed yesterday Romero's ball going through the green and stopped against/by the rake on the hillside above the bunker. They said he marked the ball with a tee, removed the rake (before the official got there)....and then the official gave him a 1-stroke penalty for 'moving the ball'.

They didn't say more on this but I wondered, what else could you have done, except yes, wait for an official? Isn't that the proper method?

The issue is did the ball move? The presence of an official cannot change that fact.

(BTW, be careful with phrases like "through the green." The rules may mean sometihng different from what you do.)

[coralpro]

One would have to know whether it was laying on it or just up against it I presume. This is the rule pertaining to a moveable obstruction.

Rule 24. Obstructions

Definitions
All defined terms are in italics and are listed alphabetically in the Definitions section.

24-1. Movable ObstructionA player may take relief, without penalty, from a movable obstruction as follows:

a. If the ball does not lie in or on the obstruction, the obstruction may be removed. If the ball moves, it must be replaced, and there is no penalty, provided that the movement of the ball is directly attributable to the removal of the obstruction. Otherwise, Rule 18-2a applies.

b. If the ball lies in or on the obstruction, the ball may be lifted and the obstruction removed. The ball must through the green or in a hazard be dropped, or on the putting green be placed, as near as possible to the spot directly under the place where the ball lay in or on the obstruction, but not nearer the hole.

[Bulls9999]

Ah, maybe that's what happened. I'm not sure if they showed the entire sequence, but all I saw was the guy marking the ball's position, and moving the rake, before the official got there. They said something about the official getting there and giving him a stroke penalty....don't know why, if the official wasn't there to see it? Maybe he didn't drop the ball and just left it where it was after moving the rake? Anyway, the pleasant thing was, he chipped it onto the green and holed it from 30-40 feet for par despite the penalty...they said if not for the penalty, he'd be tied for the lead with Woody.

Originally Posted by coralpro

One would have to know whether it was laying on it or just up against it I presume. This is the rule pertaining to a moveable obstruction.

Rule 24. Obstructions

Definitions
All defined terms are in italics and are listed alphabetically in the Definitions section.

24-1. Movable ObstructionA player may take relief, without penalty, from a movable obstruction as follows:

a. If the ball does not lie in or on the obstruction, the obstruction may be removed. If the ball moves, it must be replaced, and there is no penalty, provided that the movement of the ball is directly attributable to the removal of the obstruction. Otherwise, Rule 18-2a applies.

b. If the ball lies in or on the obstruction, the ball may be lifted and the obstruction removed. The ball must through the green or in a hazard be dropped, or on the putting green be placed, as near as possible to the spot directly under the place where the ball lay in or on the obstruction, but not nearer the hole.

[Bulls9999]

OK, now that Romero is in contention (leader by 1) they've replayed the penalty stroke that could have bearing on the tournament. He hit his 2nd shot on the par-5 18th....rolled across the green and almost went into a back bunker, but stopped on the downhill grass leading into the bunker, stopped by the handle of the rake laying on the grass. He marked the ball with a tee, removed the rake, then proceeded to pick up the ball and replaced it. He was penalized for moving the ball....why he picked it up, I don't know....if the ball didn't move, he should have just removed his tee and hit the shot. OK, he chipped it in for Birdie (not par as I had said)....would have been for eagle without the penalty.

Originally Posted by Bulls9999

Just turned the GC on and they showed yesterday Romero's ball going through the green and stopped against/by the rake on the hillside above the bunker. They said he marked the ball with a tee, removed the rake (before the official got there)....and then the official gave him a 1-stroke penalty for 'moving the ball'.

They didn't say more on this but I wondered, what else could you have done, except yes, wait for an official? Isn't that the proper method?

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by Bulls9999

OK, now that Romero is in contention (leader by 1) they've replayed the penalty stroke that could have bearing on the tournament. He hit his 2nd shot on the par-5 18th....rolled across the green and almost went into a back bunker, but stopped on the downhill grass leading into the bunker, stopped by the handle of the rake laying on the grass. He marked the ball with a tee, removed the rake, then proceeded to pick up the ball and replaced it. He was penalized for moving the ball....why he picked it up, I don't know....if the ball didn't move, he should have just removed his tee and hit the shot. OK, he chipped it in for Birdie (not par as I had said)....would have been for eagle without the penalty.

That makes sense now. He was penalized for lifting his ball when it wasn't allowed. The only way he was allowed to touch it is IF it moved when he moved the rake. Since the ball didn't move then, he was in error.

[petermo]

At least he didn't step on the rake!