Michelle Wie 24/7

[tour_insider]

Originally Posted by rodney_c

Him walking up and doing the talking?

Yep, he actually stopped her as she was walking to 8 tee.

[rodney_c]

Originally Posted by tour_insider

Yep, he actually stopped her as she was walking to 8 tee.

I've no reason to doubt your word on it. The guy who told me she did the talking was only a normal spectator, so he could have had hoards of people between him and her.

[chopdonkey]

I have just one simple question for all of the Wie supporters.

Based on all reports I have read the following occurred:

1. Nared stopped Wie and talked to her and then she withdrew (there is speculation that an LPGA exec reminded him of the 88 rule for non-tour members).

2. Wie stated the previous day that the wrists were fine and would not be a problem and that she didn't want to discuss the injusry because everyone already "knew" what had happened. At any rate it was in the past.

3. Wies playing partners had complained that BJ wie was giving advice during the round which could have resulted in a 2 stroke penalty.

4. Wie herself said in her post round that a) she was aware of the 88 rule and shooting 88 was not a concern b) she would be on the practice range the next day

5. On the golf channel broadcast last night, the announcer stated that a sourec close to MW had spoken to her and that they were not even aware of the 88 rule.

6. She played 16 holes of golf and could not finish 2 holes.

So my question to the fans is, how do you stand behind someone like this? How do you justify these actions? I can see remaining a fan, but what would compel you to think this girl is the real deal?

I openly admit that I am a "hater". I have thought she was an unaccomplised joke from day 1. Sure she could beat me in a round of golf, but as my monniker states I am a chop donkey. I think she is talented, but no where near talented enough to justify the hype.

Nike must be proud.

[rodney_c]

Originally Posted by chopdonkey

Based on all reports I have read the following occurred:

4. Wie herself said in her post round that a) she was aware of the 88 rule and shooting 88 was not a concern b) she would be on the practice range the next day

That's not the case. She didn't say she was aware of the rule. She was asked about shooting 88 rule and she said she didn't consider shooting 88. She did not say she knew about the rule. I don't think she even understood the question.

Originally Posted by chopdonkey

6. She played 16 holes of golf and could not finish 2 holes.

I think she physically could have, but why would she? Players withdraw while shooting bad rounds in practically every event. It just doesn't draw attention unless it is a big name player.
Natalie also withdrew after an 80 but got no publicity and nobody will care when she plays the lpga championship.

Originally Posted by chopdonkey

So my question to the fans is, how do you stand behind someone like this? How do you justify these actions?

She played an event she had a withdrawal. So what!
Players withdraw in nearly every event. Take the Lumber Classic where many players were shooting worse scores than her and withdrew. 10 players withdrew. I didn't attack them and insult their morals for not completing their rounds. The fact is if any other player did what Michelle Wie did, for whatever reason, you wouldn't care about it.

[rodney_c]

Michelle's injury was definetely bothering her unless you want to call David Leadbetter a lier as well.

"David Leadbetter, who is at the PGA Tour’s Memorial this week, heard about his pupil’s WD through the grapevine. He said the wrist was troubling her during practice rounds when he was with her earlier in the week in Mt. Pleasant. Monday was only the second time in five months Wie had played 18 holes.

“The doctors said this is natural,” said Leadbetter. “You’re going to have some pain in your wrist, you’re just going to have to play your way through it. ... I said to her and to her parents, keep your expectations low this week.”

[Leaguegolf]

Originally Posted by rodney_c

The fact is if any other player did what Michelle Wie did, for whatever reason, you wouldn't care about it.

Yes, players WD from every event for various and sometimes dubious reasons. We'll add this one to the dubious list. You've been telling us for years that Wie is not just "any other player." She's always been treated differently than other players, by the LPGA, the media, and major sponsors. Why should things be any different now?

You can't deny that the circumstances surrounding this incident reek. When it's all said and done, it's just another "incident" in Wie's career. An incident that needn't have happened like it did and one that Wie certainly didn't need right now. After the ton of negativity in the last year, Wie found a way to turn the positive aspect of her returning to the game into another opportunity for her detractors to pile on. Somewhere down the road Wie will do something positive for herself and her career. "Down the road" is looking farther and farther away.

[GolfSavage]

If Wie shot a 65 and ended up winning the event, the haters would still find something bad to say, so all the venom and spite spewed against her for WD is not surprising. Sure, those of us who want to see her perform well are disappointed that she is having problems. But from what I recall she only agreed to play this event because Annika invited her and she wanted to test herself before the big event next week, the McDonald's LPGA Championship.

As far as I know, none of us here know for sure whether her wrists bothered her from the start of her round, or not. I've had wrist injuries that were not as severe as hers, and after I thought I was healed I tried golfing and had to play the last few holes with pain because the wrist startd getting inflamed. I suspect the first few holes she wasn't playing well due to her absence from competition. Perhaps she tried too hard to perform at full force, and that began aggravating the wrist(s). By the time she got to #7, her wrists may have been really bothering her. She was playing out of the rough a lot, and it all had to have a cumulative effect.

I'm sure her manager knew about the 88 thing, so he knew they were not only risking further damage to her wrists, they were risking damage to her career. Yes, she may have gotten a pass from the commish, but that couldn't be guaranteed at that moment. So what would it serve her to finish out the round?

I bet the conversation betwenn Wie and her manager was something like this:

Manager: Hey, how's the wrists?
Wie: A little sore. All these extra strokes are making it worse.
Manager: Well, I don't see any sense in making it worse. I suggest you withdraw and we concentrate on getting you ready for next week.
Wie: Why don't I try to finish out the round. I think I can make it.
Manager: I'm sure you could, but if you bogey both holes or worse, you might have other problems besides your wrists. Remember that "88 rule"?
Wie: Oh yeah! Well, all things considered, you're probably right. Man, I'm gonna catch a lot of grief for this!
Manager: You let me worry about that! You just work on getting better so you can play next week!
Wie: OK! HEY! LPGA OFFICIAL! I need to talk to you!

I think Wie withdrew this week mainly for the same reason Mickelson withdrew this week from his event - to save something for the upcoming major.

[tour_insider]

She clearly either knew the rule or her manager told her the rule on the way to 8 tee. Neither of her playing partners believed her wrist bothered her at any time during the round.

This was bagging it to avoid the 88, and that I have a major problem with.

This wasn't a simple "WD".

[coralpro]

They discussed the 88 rule last night and never was it remotely suggested that the rule could be waived by the commisioner. They just plainly stated if she shot 88 then she would be prohibited from playing the rest of the year in any LPGA sanctioned event. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know why she chose to quit when she did. Another double or two bogies on the final two holes and she was toast for the rest of the year. Personally I think the LPGA should add the average stroke total to the final two holes which would be .82 strokes per hole for the final two which rounding off to the closest integer would be 2 strokes which would have put her at 88. If she had of hurt her wrist then she would have pulled out at that point to prevent aggravation or further damage which she didn't do and only pulled out when it looked like the possibility existed she might add 2 more to her score on the final two holes. She plans on practicing today so how could her wrist be injured? This is just another tactical move on the Wie team and it is time they were called on it.

[Leaguegolf]

Originally Posted by rodney_c

Michelle's injury was definetely bothering her unless you want to call David Leadbetter a lier as well.

"David Leadbetter, who is at the PGA Tour’s Memorial this week, heard about his pupil’s WD through the grapevine. He said the wrist was troubling her during practice rounds when he was with her earlier in the week in Mt. Pleasant. Monday was only the second time in five months Wie had played 18 holes.

“The doctors said this is natural,” said Leadbetter. “You’re going to have some pain in your wrist, you’re just going to have to play your way through it. ... I said to her and to her parents, keep your expectations low this week.”

So Leadbetter's words are now gospel? You previously denounced Leadbetter and his comments about Wie and now you cite him as a reliable source? Of course he's going to say whatever he can to support Wie. He's her coach, remember? It's called covering your and protecting a lucrative job.

BTW.......I don't think even Wie hater's expectations were as low as her actual performance.

[GolfSavage]

Originally Posted by coralpro

She plans on practicing today so how could her wrist be injured? This is just another tactical move on the Wie team and it is time they were called on it.

Practicing and playing are two different things. While practicing you can test your limits with different swings or speeds to see if it helps ease the pain. You don't have to hit from the rough or out of the sand while practicing. They may have to try different ways of wrapping her wrists or applying other supports. Just because they say she's going to the practice range doesn't mean she's gonna do a Tiger or VJ marathon session, hitting 1000 balls or more.

[tour_insider]

Originally Posted by GolfSavage

Practicing and playing are two different things. While practicing you can test your limits with different swings or speeds to see if it helps ease the pain. You don't have to hit from the rough or out of the sand while practicing. They may have to try different ways of wrapping her wrists or applying other supports. Just because they say she's going to the practice range doesn't mean she's gonna do a Tiger or VJ marathon session, hitting 1000 balls or more.

She almost tripped up yesterday and said she was going to the practice range before correcting herself and saying she was taking the rest of the day off.

Nobody's buying the injury story, unless Greg Nared is a physical trainer in addition to being an agent at William Morris.

Chris Higgs, the LPGA's senior veep and COO, talked to Nared (Wie's agent) on the 6th hole, then went and talked to Michelle. When asked if he and Nared had discussed the 88 rule, Higgs said the conversation was "between me and him." Translation: yes, they had.

This whole thing is just garbage. This is probably part of the reason they don't want 17 year olds out on the Tour to begin with.

[rodney_c]

Originally Posted by coralpro

Personally I think the LPGA should add the average stroke total to the final two holes which would be .82 strokes per hole for the final two which rounding off to the closest integer would be 2 strokes which would have put her at 88.

That would be an interesting rule change. That would mean if someone pulled out after 1 hole and they had a quad bogey on that hole, that you would credit them with the average quad bogey on each hole and give them a +72 score for the round.

[Leaguegolf]

Originally Posted by GolfSavage

If Wie shot a 65 and ended up winning the event, the haters would still find something bad to say.....

No...... I suspect they'd be in too deep of a state of shock to say much. Not right away anyway.

Originally Posted by golfsavage

I suspect the first few holes she wasn't playing well due to her absence from competition. Perhaps she tried too hard to perform at full force, and that began aggravating the wrist(s). By the time she got to #7, her wrists may have been really bothering her.

You do know that she was +7 after five holes and that #7 was her 16th hole of day, right?

Originally Posted by golfsavage

I'm sure her manager knew about the 88 thing, so he knew they were not only risking further damage to her wrists, they were risking damage to her career. Yes, she may have gotten a pass from the commish, but that couldn't be guaranteed at that moment. So what would it serve her to finish out the round?

It's not how Wie would be served by fininshing the round that's in question here. It's how she was served by NOT finishing the round that smells.

[rodney_c]

Originally Posted by Leaguegolf

So Leadbetter's words are now gospel? You previously denounced Leadbetter and his comments about Wie and now you cite him as a reliable source?

I simply denounced what he said on her schedule. He shouldn't have spoken on her schedule. Her injury is different, given that he was with her instructing her during her practice in the lead up, it is likely he would know the state that her injury was in.

[rodney_c]

Originally Posted by Leaguegolf

It's not how Wie would be served by fininshing the round that's in question here. It's how she was served by NOT finishing the round that smells.

There is no proof either way of whether the 88 did affect her decision to withdraw.
If that was part of her decision, I think it was just a very sensible decision and a decision any sensible player would take under those circumstances.

But a real question is why was she on her way to shooting 86 or 88 or whatever and there is proof that she was injured as from Leadbetter's comments.

[GolfSavage]

Originally Posted by Leaguegolf

You do know that she was +7 after five holes and that #7 was her 16th hole of day, right?

Take your patronizing somewhere else. It's not needed in a civilized discussion. I assumed anyone who was following this knew her position on the course and her score, as it has been mentioned several times that she withdrew between #7 and #8with a +14 on the card, leaving her last 2 holes unplayed. I just didn't see the need to repeat everything that had already been hashed over time and again. I give my fellow board members more credit than that.

[tour_insider]

Originally Posted by GolfSavage

I'm sure her manager knew about the 88 thing, so he knew they were not only risking further damage to her wrists, they were risking damage to her career. Yes, she may have gotten a pass from the commish, but that couldn't be guaranteed at that moment. So what would it serve her to finish out the round?

1. It would have showed she was honest, mature and had character.
2. It would have taught her to gut it out and do your best.

I can't imagine a worse thing to teach a 17 year old than "if you aren't playing well, quit."

It should be implicit in my comments that I don't believe whatsoever that she was too injured to finish her round.

[rodney_c]

Originally Posted by tour_insider

It should be implicit in my comments that I don't believe whatsoever that she was too injured to finish her round.

Do you believe that Phil was too injured to have finished his round, given that he said it wasn't bad at all, he was just withdrawing as a precaution.

Or how about Zach Johnson who withdrew after a triple bogey on the 15th hole. Could he have physcially played 3 more holes. Of course.

[tour_insider]

Originally Posted by rodney_c

There is no proof either way of whether the 88 did affect her decision to withdraw.
If that was part of her decision, I think it was just a very sensible decision and a decision any sensible player would take under those circumstances.

But a real question is why was she on her way to shooting 86 or 88 or whatever and there is proof that she was injured as from Leadbetter's comments.

Leadbetter's comments are in no way proof of any injury.

And I agree, the real question is why was she on her way to such a high number, because I don't believe she was injured.