Cheaters Never Prosper.......Or Do They?

[Leaguegolf]

The old adage tells us "cheaters never prosper" but is that really true? We've all played with guys that have been suspected of more than just bending the rules. Who knows, maybe you're one of those guys.

Here's your chance to vent about the guys you're not sure about, rat out the guys you are sure about, or tell us what you've done that may have been in the gray area of the Rule Book. Tell us what they do and what you've done to deal with them and the "situations" as they arose. No reason to hold back here......

[Lefty]

This one really makes my blood boil.

We have a guy who play off five and regards rules as an opportunity. I always play to the spirit of the law. If I am stuck behind a tree, a little casual water may allow me to engineer a drop where I can play a full shot to the green.In my simple world ,that is borderline cheating and not the correct play. He will stamp around trying to find a moist patch.

If it has been raining and the water hazard has grown, he will claim it is casual water outside the hazard and he should get a free drop. People who do not know him give him drops in favourable places....his idea of nearest point is different to my geometery teacher's definition.

[J.D.]

I will out myself...

Once...a long time ago...

In trying to keep pace with my then future Father in Law, fudged my score on several holes to make my score card look a tad better than it was...(I was on pace for a crowd pleasing 130)

He caught on to what I was doing and called me on it...

Never fudged since...

JD

[Putton]

Originally Posted by Lefty

This one really makes my blood boil.

We have a guy who play off five and regards rules as an opportunity. I always play to the spirit of the law. If I am stuck behind a tree, a little casual water may allow me to engineer a drop where I can play a full shot to the green.In my simple world ,that is borderline cheating and not the correct play. He will stamp around trying to find a moist patch.

If it has been raining and the water hazard has grown, he will claim it is casual water outside the hazard and he should get a free drop. People who do not know him give him drops in favourable places....his idea of nearest point is different to my geometery teacher's definition.

Are you talking about your friend or yourself here.?

[Lefty]

If I am in that position I do not take a drop, he will insist on it

[essurfer]

since I usually play alone, Dont have anyone to cheat with...

[GenErr]

Our league had a notorious brother team whose antics have become legend in our ranks. Everyone in the league has a story about playing against them.

Some of my recollections:
I once had to tell the younger brother that he wasn't allowed to drag his sand wedge behind the ball creating a line, prior to his hitting the shot. He acted surprised and said he didn't know that rule, but it helped him focus on where his club should enter the sand. He'd been playing golf for over 10 years and knew the rules.

Another time, as he was searching for his ball in the rough he yelled over to me, "hey I found my ball and one other one, I'm gonna hit the other ball toward the green because I'm not sure what club I need." I yelled back "no, you can't do that." Before the words left my mouth, he had hit the extra ball toward the green.

Those are but a few antics of the infamous ________ Brothers. Thankfully they left our league around 5 years ago, but their legend lives on!

[boomer]

Played with aguy a few times in "friendly" saturday mornings group...no money on the line, but still....Hits his ball out of boundsand you could tell it was going out. Usually rode by him self but that day he rode with me. we were driving to the area
and looking just in case it hit a tree we did not see. As we turn to head back towards the "drop area" where he should play stroke and distance to keep pace an we usually did. He spies a ball. Low and be hold he claims it as his. Because his son "5" had marked it for him.... Black marker all over it. and it WAS his type of ball. At this time i told him " you haven't played that ball off the tee all day but have used it to putt a few times so you could tell your son you played with it. The one you hit off the tee had your usual dots" Nice drop though, your hitting 3".

He did not dispute the call.

[JungleJ]

Originally Posted by Lefty

This one really makes my blood boil.

We have a guy who play off five and regards rules as an opportunity. I always play to the spirit of the law. If I am stuck behind a tree, a little casual water may allow me to engineer a drop where I can play a full shot to the green.In my simple world ,that is borderline cheating and not the correct play. He will stamp around trying to find a moist patch.

If it has been raining and the water hazard has grown, he will claim it is casual water outside the hazard and he should get a free drop. People who do not know him give him drops in favourable places....his idea of nearest point is different to my geometery teacher's definition.

He sounds like most pro golfers - your stance is commendable but most players will happily allow the Rules to work to their advantage.

[Nyper]

Some people I have played with and competed against regularly in the past:

Guy A:
This guy always marks his ball on the green by putting a dime or whatever in front of his ball instead of behind it. Then, when he puts his ball back, he puts it in front of the mark. Doing this moves his ball closer to the hole by about an inch. The guy was a good golfer and didn't need to cheat.

Guy B:
This guy liked to improve his lie - everywhere. If he was right smack in the middle of the fairway with a perfect lie, that just wasn't good enough for him. He would always twist up the grass making a perfect little tee for the ball. Again.. he was a good golfer and didn't need to do this.

Guy C:
This was about 8 years ago, back in a high school tournament. This guy just wasn't much good. He hadn't been playing a long time. The worst part was, he liked to talk smack like he was an awesome golfer. On his way to shooting about 110, he hooks his ball over in the weeds. Our foursome, coaches, and parents spend a good 5 minutes looking for the ball. Finally one of the coaches says "I think it's lost. You need to go back and hit another one."

With about 13 or 14 people standing there watching, the reaches into his pocket, and casually flips a ball out in the weeds where he is standing and says "Oh! I found it!"

We were all thinking "wow.. did he really just do that?". His coach just says "I don't think so Johnny (or whatever his name was). You need to go take your drop and hit another."

Johnny then says in the girliest whiniest voice in the world: "BUT COOOOAAACH! I FFFFOOOOUND IT!"

Me and the other 2 golfers in our foursome just lost it. We laughed so hard WE almost cried! Poor guy...

[300Yards]

I had a guy I played with, take a bad tee shot, which I clearly saw go straight right. I take my shot, and it's a nice one, s;ight fade, that splits the fairway. We go over to take our next shots, and he looks for his ball, claiming he can't find it. I pointed out where I saw him hit, but neither of us could find it. He takes a drop, and hits his balls closer to the green, but still short. I take mine, and as I'm closer, I put it on the green. We get up to the green, he hits his shot onto the green, and I take my 2putt, sinking it for birdie. Here's where the cheat comes in: He suddenly claims to have found his ball. Somehow magicaly, his slice turned into a hook, and he landed it beside the green. I told him there's no way, his ball flew 450yards, and landed that close. He insisted he did. I told him I saw his ball fly right, and he said he saw it go straight. I asked him then why did I help him look for it, if he saw it go straight?

Needless to saw, I caught onto him, and told him to play straight, or find someone else to cheat with, I would not tolerate it.

[GenErr]

One of my all time favorites, and it happens a lot.

We're looking for someone's ball in the rough or trees and we find a ball.
We ask the person "what kind of ball are you hitting?"
I love the reply "Well, what did you find?"

[jcgolfpro]

There is a certain TOUR player that has cheated AND prospered...greatly.

[C-Tech]

I used to play with a guy who told me after months of winning skins off of us, "If you would just carry a ball in your pocket exactly like the one you are playing, you would never have a lost ball penalty."

[xnavyct]

I might go out there and shoot 103, but its at least an honest 103 !

[lukiesdad13]

I played in a very friendly loose league when I first started to play 1987). By friendly I mean most of the guys didn't even play their opponents. When they got to the course they just went off with whoever was there. I was told this is how the league always ran. Who would cheat in a church league? You met up in the clubhouse after and then exchanged scorecards and figured out who won. The league itself was a church league that had started in the 1940s. One of the guys in the league was an ORIGINAL member. Great guy but he couldnt count to save his life. He was already in his 80s and hit the ball maybe 100 yds. He never kept his own scorecard so he either relied on a playing partner to or he waited until he got in the clubhouse and tried to remember what he got. He never added in his putts to his score either - you had to watch how many he took. He'd be on a 550 yd par 5 and say 7 when you just saw him 3 putt and you know he hit at least 7 shots from the fairway. Hard to beat a guy who doesn't count in 25 putts to his total.

[jcgolfpro]

I worked for a golf professional when I was starting out that would NEVER lose a ball regardless of whether he hit into 10 foot deep grass or wherever. His lie in the tall grass was always perfect. On the greens he was caught doing the old ball mark flip...he would always be the first to the green and would flip his mark 10-12 feet closer to the hole if he could. His was merely a case of not being able to accept age and he found other ways to score the same as when he could play.

[1putt]

When I first started playing I fudged a tiny, just a little, ok alot, but so did everyone else I played with. That probably got me started. Then as I grew as a golfer I realized I was not hurting anyone but myself. Some of my old friends still due, they think a little roll there or a push here don't hurt. But I look at it as that's their game, needless to say they do not play in any scrambles or tournaments.

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by Lefty

This one really makes my blood boil.

We have a guy who play off five and regards rules as an opportunity. I always play to the spirit of the law. If I am stuck behind a tree, a little casual water may allow me to engineer a drop where I can play a full shot to the green.In my simple world ,that is borderline cheating and not the correct play. He will stamp around trying to find a moist patch.

If it has been raining and the water hazard has grown, he will claim it is casual water outside the hazard and he should get a free drop. People who do not know him give him drops in favourable places....his idea of nearest point is different to my geometery teacher's definition.

In this you are only cheating yourself. The rules give you bad breaks so often, that when you get a chance to use them to your advantage, take it. Look at this scenario. A player's ball is almost against the trunk of a tree. To play toward the the green is impossible. His only reasonable play is to pitch out to the fairway in a direction which is even farther from the hole. He takes his stance to pitch out, and finds that in doing so he is standing in casual water. By the rules, he is entitled to relief from the casual water. He locates the nearest point of relief, then he is allowed a club length from there in which to drop. He takes his drop correctly and finds out that the new location has taken the tree completely out of play in his line toward the green. Is he now allowed to play toward the green? Or does he still have to pitch out? He can play to the green because he did everything by the rules, and in this case the rules worked for him.

It's silly to not take advantage of the rules when the opportunity is there. I don't condone bending or breaking them, only playing by the book. To say that taking relief and then getting an advantage because of it is against the "spirit" of the rules makes no sense. You can't choose when to play by the rules and when not to. That's sort of what this thread is all about. IMO, cheating yourself of an opportunity for relief is just as bad as letting your opponent cheat against you.

[Leaguegolf]

Originally Posted by jcgolfpro

There is a certain TOUR player that has cheated AND prospered...greatly.

Are you referring to VJ's history or do you have evidence of someone else?

[JustMe]

Since my kid plays with his high school team and a bigger tour, I can say yes, I, as a parent have seen some cheaters. The way hubby and myself look at...it's the responsibility of him/kid to watch and pay attention to who he's playing with.

Kid has learned, though it took him a year, LOL, and now if he suspects cheating he'll either contact his coach, Marshall, or refuse to sign the card until he has spoken with someone in charge.

I have seen kids throw balls...no kidding...foot wedge, and drop balls. I always inform him after the tourney that so and so was cheating. Never during a tourney did I nor hubby let him/kid know that someone was cheating. Sad really, but he pays attention now.

[GolfSavage]

One of my friends, although an avid golfer, is ignorant of many of the rules of golf that every golfer should know. And it irks him when I tell him about it, although he tries not to let on! He and I and two other friends were playing on a course where the greens were in decent shape, with a 25 cent skin on each hole. We'd pushed the last 3 holes, and I had just sunk a 12 footer for birdie. The other 2 guys had made par, so my friend had to make his 6 footer to push yet again. About 3 feet in front of his ball was an old ball mark that wasn't repaired very well. It wasn't really even directly in his line. He wanted to get "relief" from the ball mark, and move his ball to one side to avoid hitting the mark! I told him I wouldn't allow it, but he was more than welcome to repair the ball mark as he saw fit. Well, he missed the putt, and that set him in a mood for the next few holes. He played so poorly it was hard to believe it was the same guy. I told him if he could find a ruling giving relief from ball marks on the green, I'd give him every skin I won that day!